As these words are being written, the U.S. and its NATO allies continue to posture themselves in Europe and in the Middle East prior to the “big one” being kicked off. As mentioned in previous reports and articles, the flash points are becoming much more defined: The Senkaku Islands, the Donbass Region of Ukraine, Syria, and the Korean Peninsula. While the world watches, each side in these potential hot spots continues to build their forces in the regions and make preparations for conflict. When we examine responses for those preparations, it is obvious that war is imminent.
The United States has been posturing troops in the former SSR nations on Russia’s Western border. Supplies of tanks, artillery pieces, aircraft, ammunition, and American troops continue to pour into Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, and Poland, among others. The posturing amounts to a regeneration of NATO/USSR Cold War lines with one major difference: with the SSR’s no longer in existence, the NATO lines are that much closer now to Russia. Before those Soviet satellite nations provided a physical buffer, but those former buffers are now nations that openly host NATO and U.S. troops.
While claiming to have a ceasefire, the U.S. turns a blind eye to the fact that Russia is still pounding away at the “rebels,” as Newspeak terms them. They’re really insurgents, trying to topple an established government that will not knuckle under to the likes of the Nulands and McCains as Ukraine did. Furthermore, the Russians are backing Assad with no plans of pulling out of his corner.
Turkey is another matter, and Turkish Prime Minister Erdogan has been pushing the envelope with deployments of troops to the Syrian border and incursions that mimic “Fabian” tactics – small-scale, limited engagements comprised of small unit skirmishes and then a quick retreat back to the safety of the Turkish border. Still, Turkey is amassing sizable numbers of men and large quantities of materials and it doesn’t take much cognition to deduce that Turkey is preparing to invade. Recently President Vladimir Putin declared his willingness to use tactical nuclear weapons if faced with a Turkish and/or Saudi invasion of Syria.
Ladies and gentlemen, this is serious, as Russia proved with the Crimea in 2014. Crimea is decried by the West as conquest and occupation, but this is not accurate: moreover, it’s a lie. The U.S. attempted to institute a coup d’état by deposing the rightfully elected leader of Ukraine and inserting Yatsenuk. They wanted to cut of Sevastopol, Russia’s strategic naval base that enables the Black Sea Fleet to enter the Mediterranean. The West also paints a picture of imposed servitude over the populace, while “neglecting” to mention that almost 90% of Crimea are Russians ethnically, speaking Russian as their first language.
Russia didn’t play softball. They won’t be playing wiffleball, either, when things kick off in Syria. This is not to say there aren’t economic influences that prompt Russia to act; however, they are secondary to the aggressive and imperialistic actions taken by the phony coalition of NATO at the behest of the IMF and the Military-Industrial Complex.
Forbes recently posted a piece by Adam Ereli entitled “Putin’s Newest Satellite State,” in which the following is written:
“…Russia quietly signed a sweeping air defense agreement with Armenia, accelerating a growing Russian military buildup that has unfolded largely under the radar. It was the most tangible sign yet that Putin is creating a new satellite state on NATO’s border and threatening an indispensable U.S. ally [Turkey].”
Now Mr. Ereli is listed as a former deputy spokesman of the State Department, and his carefully-chosen words act as if Russia is the aggressor against Turkey. He also wrote:
“…as Russia’s war in Syria and pressure on Turkey has intensified…The growing Russian military presence in Armenia is but the latest indicator of a worrisome trend: Putin’s threat to NATO and America’s interests in Europe.”
Last check, Mr. Ereli, it was Turkey that shot down Russian aircraft and helicopters. Not to mention the fact that with all of these NATO exercises and additional troop deployments, what is Russia supposed to do? Not defend its interests?
Ereli finishes off his piece with this:
“In July 2015, Turkey and the U.S. finalized an agreement to work cooperatively to combat Islamic State terrorists in Syria and Iraq.”
Perhaps Ereli is referring to the terrorists that the U.S. created, trained, and funded that have been wreaking havoc throughout the Middle East, now, since the Arab Spring began. To address the more infuriating issue, the “unfolded largely under the radar” statement, there is nothing that is happening or has happened that is anything other than deliberate and purposeful.
Under the radar, such as TARS being removed from the Gulf Coast and Southern Border of the U.S. Under the radar: the mothballing of planned Air Defense installations in Czechoslovakia and other Eastern European nations. Under the radar, such as when Obama told Medvedev to tell Putin how he (Obama) would “have more leeway [with U.S. ICBM’s] after the election,” a statement as treasonous as they come. Under the radar for the removal of the SR-71, the Tomahawk Cruise Missile, and the A-10 Tank Killer. Under the radar for the cashiering of General Officers and Senior Noncommissioned Officers (the word “cashiering” being readily substitutable for the word “purging,” a more applicable and accurate term) from the U.S. military command structure.
The RAND Corporation recently released a study that concluded that Russian forces could overrun the Baltics in under 72 hours. War games were run by RAND for several months in 2014-2015 and the studies concluded that the NATO forces were so ill-equipped and understrength that a loss would be inevitable. An article published this month chronicles the gist of the RAND study, entitled If Russia Started a War in the Baltics, NATO Would Lose — Quickly, by Dan De Luce,
Jeremiah Johnson is the Nom de plume of a retired Green Beret of the United States Army Special Forces (Airborne). Mr. Johnson is also a Gunsmith, a Certified Master Herbalist, a Montana Master Food Preserver, and a graduate of the U.S. Army’s SERE school (Survival Evasion Resistance Escape). He lives in a cabin in the mountains of Western Montana with his wife and three cats. You can follow Jeremiah’s regular writings at SHTFplan.com.
This article may be republished or excerpted with proper attribution to the author and a link to www.SHTFplan.com.
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Sad where this country is headed.
Be well all…
What if we collectively could stop fighting each other, and work together to make this place better???
I know, dreaming again…
Clinton to Donor: In Next War, I’ll Let Israel Kill 200,000, Not Just 2,000, Gazans
themideastbeast DOT com/clinton-to-donor-in-next-war-i-will-let-israel-kill-200000-not-just-2000-gazans/
Truly a psychopath.
“They wanted to cut of Sevastopol, Russia’s strategic naval base that enables the Black Sea Fleet to enter the Mediterranean”
Actually JJ, no, they didn’t exactly. They already had a fleet floating off-shore in the black sea, waiting for the go-ahead to take over the navy base. Here’s your link
http://www.fort-russ.com/2016/02/us-control-over-crimea-aim-of-coup-in.html
They had already opened up for contract bidding to do the remodeling.
Here’s the link to those govt documents. (Such a pity they had to cancel their take-over)
Renovation of Sevastopol School #5, Ukraine – Federal Business Opportunities: Opportunities
https://www.fbo.gov/?s=opportunity&mode=form&id=2bb691b61c59be3a68180bd8c614a0cb&tab=core&_cview=1
“They wanted to cut of Sevastopol, Russia’s strategic naval base that enables the Black Sea Fleet to enter the Mediterranean”
Actually JJ, no, they didn’t exactly. They already had a fleet floating off-shore in the black sea, waiting for the go-ahead to take over the navy base. Here’s your link
ht_tp://www.fort-russ.com/2016/02/us-control-over-crimea-aim-of-coup-in.html
They had already opened up for contract bidding to do the remodeling.
Here’s the link to those govt documents. (Such a pity they had to cancel their take-over)
Renovation of Sevastopol School #5, Ukraine – Federal Business Opportunities: Opportunities
ht_tps://www.fbo.gov/?s=opportunity&mode=form&id=2bb691b61c59be3a68180bd8c614a0cb&tab=core&_cview=1
If the pawns refuse to move…there can be NO game of chess…
Be Right,
A very keen observation. Of course I could say that the knights could move & engage but I take your point. A la the old saying we had in the 60’s, ‘What if they had a war but nobody showed up?’.
Just watched part of that talk by Larkin Rose who made the same point. Encouraging to think that mankind may finally be waking up.
Loved the chess analogy. May I use it?
Slap
It has happened before…during WWI. At Christmas time, soldiers from both sides crossed no man’s land and exchanged gifts. After the celebration, they refused to kill each other as they saw there was little difference between them and no reason to want the other side dead. Commanders on both sides of the war were furious and demanded they begin killing each other again, but the men refused. Eventually they had to reassign the men to other parts of the front so that they would not have to face men they now saw as friends and equals. After this, they got the meat grinder of pointless war going again. So yes, it has been tried but it ultimately failed.
We would like to see ourselves as having advanced as a race since those times, but have we? We may well have seen amazing advances in technology but mankind has remained unchanged. The average man is still not a thinker or a questioner and is still susceptible to the same kinds of propaganda as always. They will still mostly fight without questioning the morality of the fight. Only the intellectuals truly question these things, which is why they are so heavily persecuted by governments who are hungry for absolute power and control. Watch for it, for it is coming.
however if the pawns refuse to move then they will be replaced with new pawns wont they? that is why they are called pawns sadly enough right ?
eppe
It wouldn’t make a difference. We don’t control anything.
Caught On Tape: U.S. Test Fires Nuclear ICBM, Warns “We Are Prepared To Use Nuclear Weapons”
ht tp://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-02-26/caught-tape-us-test-fires-nuclear-icbm-warns-we-are-prepared-use-nuclear-weapons
Direct link…
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-02-26/caught-tape-us-test-fires-nuclear-icbm-warns-we-are-prepared-use-nuclear-weapons
KYMom, there was nothing ‘caught on tape’ about it. This was planned, advertised and executed as a show of force. It was not done in secret, it was done to warn Korea, China and Russia that we’re playing with our toys too.
“Caught on tape” in deed. More misleading bullshit.
I used to live near Vandenburg and watched the launches all the time. It really amazing that the Minutemen 111 still flies at all. They were designed sometime in the 1970’s and have hardly been upgraded at all.
I was stationed at Vandenburg in the 80’s and watch them drop a peace keeper missile….on the ground….
I was reading about that launch and was laughing my ass off.
Meanwhile Russia flies bombers right up to our coastline, right over Sweden, over Canida, and Obama’s answer to blatant incursions is to launch a missile over Communist California. Does Obama think he’s Kim Jong-Un? I’ll bet the Russians are really impressed with the bad boy in the White House.
ummm that’s Canada
Jeremiah Johnson, be safe. This article cements your status under the Obama administration as a certified Domestic Terrorist.
Obama will help Isis ally Turkey, blame Russia, declare martial law, suspend elections, help out the failing central bankers, and ….
And I’m overdue for my fitting for a tinfoil hat.
Still, be safe Jeremiah.
My tinfoil hat is about 2′ thick now…
Your not kidding bud, its not what we grew up in thats for sure
A couple articles ago, the Johnson said sumtin bout an emp launched by N Korea. Basically it was to be launched any minute now. I called BS fear porn on the Johnson and people fired angry arrows at me. Well I call bs on this fear porn too. The Johnson ain’t who he says he is. Wake up. Now, fire away.
the depth of the US media and govt lies in perspective::: –Crimea is 90% ethnic Russian, speaks Russian as the official language and has been considered “Russian or part of Russia longer than the American southwest.
By contrast:: California is majority Hispanic, speaks majority Spanish and although originally part of Mexico, became a US state in only 1850 after war.
Now, which country would it appear has the greater, legitimate claim of an area–Russia’s claim ( and the citizens agree) of Crimea….or the US’s claim of California which is neither American in people’s, culture or language ( and who has large segments of the populace flying mexico’s flag?)
Just some food for thought and perspective
Javelin,
Note that the majority of Mexicans showed up after Americans took over and subdued the Native Americans. Mexicans have no prior claim. Throw out illegal aliens and voila… American again.
You speak with forked tongue squaw.
Stupid
Whites have the biggest population in California and English is the language.
Get a clue
Kills your whole point
I hate this damn planet we live on. I can’t stand it any more. It’s now called A OOOOOONET!
http://www.cheriberens.net/theres-nothing-syrian-about-the-free-syrian-army.html
Other than WWIII I don’t see any other way to stop Trump and keep Obama in office.
Im pretty sure that if there is a nuclear war, Obummer’s ass is toast along with all the other lackys and lobbyists in DC.It just might be a good thing.
No, Ed, a nuclear war isn’t a ‘good thing,’ even if it gets rid of all the politicians, bureaucrats, & lobbyists in DC.
There are also millions of ‘regular folks’ who live in the greater DC Metro area who will be dead as well.
As much as I’d love to see most of them gone, a nuclear war isn’t the way it should be done.
I hope that GOD gets rid of that ugly looking devil now!
Are you happy we have a “Proven Dumb Ass” with his finger on the Nuclear Trigger.
No. Not happy at all…
The USA is occupied since 1913, by founding the FED. Every “US” war since than was a FED war.
Every “US” President was a FED President.
Arthur Schopenhauer:
All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.
https://forum.codoh.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=10215
We can only pray, that we get all those Psychophtes out of power!
Lucifer you are A real asshole.
The South has been occupied since April 1865.
And they’ve done a great job of submitting to it too haven’t they?
In case anyone hasn’t figured it out yet. The reason there will be a war with China,Russia,Iran and Syria is that these countries refuse to go along with the one world government and the one world religion. Note,China Russia and Iran aren’t taking in any refugees. Sunni is the largest Muslim group on the planet thus why Saudi Arabia has started into the conflict.America is being made weaker,through its weakening of the military,disarming its citizens while we are being invaded by illegal immigrants and refugees as are the rest of the NATO countries.
Hi Thor
Obama just increased the military budget. We have a larger military than next 10 combined, bankrupting us. I haven’t seen any gun confiscation. Chill pill.
Rebecca, with all due respect,Obama has weakened the military in many ways other then money. Forcing top generals to retire,not taking care of returning vets,women in combat roles, ect. He has done nothing but attack the second amendment since his election even after taking an oath to uphold and defend the Constitution. He also signed the UN arms treaty which has the potential to ban all guns. So while you think I need a chill pill, I think you need some no-doze! Wake up.
Thor
I am awake and honest enough to acknowledge that danger and threat are not equal to done and dirty. Chill pill.
Rebecca
Yeah right, martial law before the end of the year. Bet???
Thor
I’m with you.. Martial law… This election will never materialize!
Hilldweller
Let’s see……we have the most deeply funded military in the world, yes? And it has been the preeminent military force in the world for decades, agreed? So let’s look at our war record, shall we?
WW II – won with Russian cooperation
Korea – multi-decade tie
Vietnam – loss
Iraq – loss
Afghanistan – loss
Okay, now was Obama president during all those wars? Iraq and Afghanistan have devolved into Dodge City without Matt Dillon. I’ll grant that. Bush started those, Obama could have decidedly ended them. What we have is a multi-generational, political/military goat fuck led by people who haven’t a clue about the culture of the people they annhilate. If you don’t understand your enemies, you will never defeat them……
Silent Eyes
The goal is being achieved in the Middle East. They don’t want stable democratic governments. They want just what they’re getting chaos; you reap what you sow. Why? Because governments with resources (Libya & Iraq) can be exploited (take the USD as exclusive payment) and can’t put up opposition. If opposition does occur these governments are very fragile and are all one small effort away from removal and replacement with a government that won’t give the globalist bankers a difficult time. Syria has limited energy resources at present but great geography for oil / gas pipelines. Its value is location.
Terrorism, democracy and the most laughable, helping the respective citizens saving them from tyrannical rule are all ostensible excuses for public consumption. Its about control of energy, period.
The goal is destroy their governments and create chaos. The reason? So they are not a threat to the internationalists bankers. Libya wanted gold backed currency for its oil, Iraq wanted Euros, we demand USD exclusive payment. Unstable governments created from revolution are one step away from another revolution making subsequent governments vulnerable to regime chance if they decide to get cocky. Why bomb Libyan infrastructure? Connect the dots.
Winning comes in many forms.
JJ-
Just finished reading Bridge at Andau. Great suggestion. Lots of wisdom. Keep the posts coming, I always learn a lot from your writings.
Ender
FUCK THE PIT OF HELL!
Doubtful the US would do anything but posture. King Koon would rather screw with his nonbelievers here in the states cause it massages his huge ego. Just wait till Hitlary takes the helm. Things will really warm up then.
WWIII in 12 days, hope not.
Anybody see the story on Rbt. Spencer’s “Jihad Watch” site about the Muslim woman who placed the addresses of the homes of 180+ or our Military? According to her post, she was supplying targets for ISIS lone wolfs here in the U.S.
Prep on Garth and watch out fur dem hogs!
its the only game this cabal knows.. economic Armageddon a distraction for their elicit actions so.. start a war .. war is a racket,, all profits for the cabal and the elite
we the people are the ones they use for these wars .. you would think it would be abundantly clear to everyone by now , but stupidity is hard to cure
what if the shit heads at the top called for a war and we the people said F you,, go fight it yourself .. shit would change fast .. but everyday some brainwashed kid thinks hes “serving this country” and all he is doing is sacrificing his soul for these devils
@Enemy of the State
Where did you learn this horse shit and are you an useful idiot or a FSB troll?
Maybe you are just recycling the tired old garbage puked out by the “New Left” of the 1960’s? Do you sit around with a bunch of “gray ponytails” smoking dope and ranting junk like this….man? (Hey, Far OUT!)
Either way, piss off!
@ Seminole Wind
The late USMC major general Smedley Butler, twice awarded the MOH, wrote War is a Racket in @ 1932.
Paraphrasing loosely, “I have commanded Marines in every rank from Second Lieutenant to General Officer. I’ve come to the conclusion that all I am is hired muscle for the corporate warmongers.”
I suggest you read a bit before you dump your pig ignorant bullshit on someone else.
Maybe in 1966 the “kill a commie for Christ” bozos salivating to go over and ventilate some gooks could say they didn’t know any better. Ivy Leaguers in the Kennedy and Johnson circles didn’t know any better either.
The knowledge that Vietnam was a thousand years old struggle by the VN people, mostly against China with France, Japan and us playing small roles, has been out there for 50 years. We were the Redcoats to their Embattled Farmers.
The first step in stopping the militarism is the cannon fodder having the brains to question the lies they are fed.
As EoTS said, you can’t fix stupid. Militarists like stupid kids, because they don’t know anything to begin with, desperately want to fit into something larger than themselves, and make excellent cannon fodder. Then and still.
There’s no excuse for someone persumably in retirement age to still be that stupid.
John Allen
When the generals are saying it, ya gotta take notice.
Rebecca
That is no mere USMC MajorGeneral (as if a USMC Major General is mere) but a two time recipient of the Medal Of Honor.
“We were the Redcoats to their Embattled Farmers.”
We were actually Hessians but close enough.
Some people just don’t get it, EotS.
Smedley Butler had it right.
Interesting that there is nothing about the shooting last night,,,
Guy shot a bunch of people, but being that he was a prohibited individual and the gun laws both existing and proposed would not have stopped him you hear nothing as he was already prohibited but had guns anyway,, crickets,,, nothing, nada,,,,
caught that too
Plus the fact that he was a black man. Since he’s black, he must have done it cause whitey been keeping him down his whole life. P.O.S. should have been hung years ago for all his past crimes.
It is because he only killed white people?
First off, as my Momma used to tell me as a kid, “It takes two to make a fight”.
Secondly, the Baltic states like Estonia have asked us to reinforce them to prevent Putin’s “green men” from placing 3 FREE NATO Republics back under Russia’s control.
Thirdly, why are most Paulbot survival types so in love with a guy who wants to reinvent the Soviet Union? If most of you wrote the crap that you write about “The Gubermint” as citizens of Russia, you would be either in jail or dead.
“The fall of the Soviet Union was the biggest tragedy in History”….Vladimir Putin.
Stars I agree, it seems this site is over loaded with Putin Lovers. He’s still a little Communist Punk. First, everybody is complaining how weak Obama is, and then they cry he’s going to get us in a war, which is it “Weak or Strong”. Russia is just like Germany was during the II world war, they will run over all their little neighbors whenever they feel like it. They bulled their way over the Ukraine so they could keep their warm water port on the Black Sea, but Turkey won’t be so easy when push comes to shove. Many may not know that Turkey straddles the Bosphores Straits and the Dardanelles which can control Bully Russia’s access from the Black Sea into the Mediterranean. So all so-called Patriots need to start acting like Americans instead of wanting to bend over and kiss Putins ass. Good or Bad, America is still the Greatest Country on Earth. Trekker Out.
Mountain Trekker
Considering the track record on just foreign affairs (The domestic list is way too long) , Gulf Of Tonkin / Vietnam up to WMD in Iraq and we got rid of Gadaffi to help the Libya people using US airpower to support AQ in the process has the possibility that your government lies ever crossed your mind?
Kevin2
Have you ever considered that the World Wide Communist movement has murdered 100+ million?
I’ll take my chances with Washington over Moscow/Hanoi/Havana, ANY DAY!
You do realize that communism is an economic system and the USSR dissolved in 1991. Russia is capitalist with oligarchs vying for control that have yet to solidify it as they have here with the BB Group, Trilateral Commission, Council of Foreign Relations and the entire Wall Street cabal.
News flash, you nor I control Washington. Actually we have no more true control than a citizen in the USSR did in about 1970.
Kevin2, Make no mistake, I’m not a blind Patriot. We have most assuredly created alot of the worlds problems, such as pulling the rug out from under Hosin Mubarak of Egypt, and causing the overthrow of Saddam Hussein of Iraq and Mummar Gaddifa of Libya, all of which were brutal dictators, but they were the kind of men that could keep those types of Countries in some kind of order. But it gets really tiresome listening to so many singing the praise of that Communist Punk Putin, the KGB agent that would kick in your door in the middle of the night. Trekker Out.
“that would kick in your door in the middle of the night.”
Thats a cause of concern for anyone with a tad of knowledge in the US and its not Putin their worried about doing it.
“but they were the kind of men that could keep those types of Countries in some kind of order.”
Don’t think for a nano second that the US knocked off both of them because they were “brutal dictators”. Libya had the highest standard of living in Africa, no debt but they committed an unforgivable sin. They wanted to sell their oil for a gold backed currency. How dare they break their peg? Saddam wanted to trade his in Euros. For that 4500 US Men & Women gave their lives in a huge lie. Explain why the US used its Air Power to have AQ (remember 911, those guys) topple Libya.
Russia? Communist? Where do you come up with that? Damn…….
Read up on Bretton Woods, closing the Gold Window in 1971 and the Oil Peg.
You will find out why US Soldiers, Sailors, Air Force and Marines are fighting and dying.
” 3 FREE NATO Republics”
You possibly referring to the Ukraine where we staged a coup to overthrow a democratically elected government. Think we don’t overthrow valid democratically elected governments or stop elections from taking place.
Iran 1953 the democratically elected President decided to nationalize their oil. A CIA / UK MI5 coup occurred and the Shah of Iran, one of the most brutal dictators was installed.
The UN was to have supervised elections for the unification of Indo China in 1954 post French loss. Ho Chi Minh was going o win hands down. Can’t have that so the election is cancelled. Puppet governments subsequently installed in the newly created South Vietnam that were devoid of popular support. In the quest to put a square peg in a round hole a million Vietnamese were killed and 59,000 Americans.
I’m sure the evil US government wants some nukes dropped on America to quell the US peoples clamor for change. That and the collapse and population reduction. We have met the enemy, it has been the US neocons all along. The lies are stacked so high that killing is their only option, their specialty. No wonder the US infrastructure crumbling has been ignored, why fix what you plan to destroy further.
The problem with dropping a nuke almost anywhere in the continental US is that the fallout will rain down on DC. Its the winds.
Bring it on, let’s get rid of the lEast coast and soon.
Our idiot in charge is crazier than North Korea’s idiot in charge.
It will be the fall of Damascus that will start WWW III.
Mike I believe you are right.
This could be the TEOTWAWKI event so many have been preparing for.
WW3 will begin in the Middle East, Damascus will be destroyed.
The problem with posturing, which is essentially the kids game of chicken is the increasing likelihood of accidentally kicking off a real shooting war. The greater the number of people, nations and groups involved the risk goes up at least proportionately. Once started it takes on a “life” (funny use of that word at this juncture) of its own.
I keep repeating the story but here it goes again. A Soviet Navy Officer cast the one no vote, of all three required, to fire a “special weapon” which was a torpedo with a nuclear warhead at the US Navy. This single vote, unknown to even the USSRs higher chain of command, saved us from WWIII in October of 1962. If that is not a sobering thought AA will do you no good so just have a double.
Madness.
I doubt it. The T5 never worked and was withdrawn from service by 1960. The single nuke test, missed and the yield was less than 2 kilotons. Probably wouldnt have sunk a boat. The ASCBO wasent introduced until the end of the 1960’s
Ive heard the tale and it is only a Loooong tale.
Well its far too well documented for me to take your word for it. At 2000 tons TNT equivalent you don’t have to be that close. Sinking a ship(s) are not the point. The point is any use of a nuclear weapon in that circumstance virtually guarantees WWIII.
Your “analysis” reminds me of the well documented exchange between Air Force Chief Of Staff General Curtis LeMay and President Kennedy. LeMay wanted to invade Cuba and stated that, “The USSR will do nothing”. Kennedy’s reply, “If your wrong there will be no one left alive to tell you so”.
Just some of the documentation. Take note of the 13 foot notes.
h ttp://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/oct/27/vasili-arkhipov-stopped-nuclear-war
13 foot notes here
h ttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasili_Arkhipov
h ttp://nsarchive.gwu.edu/NSAEBB/NSAEBB75/
You missed the whole point. They had no field able torpedo that was capable of caring a nuke until the late 60’s
The T5 tests utterly failed. 15 tests and only 5 made it anywhere near the target and a single one detonated.
Suppose that sub commander in 1962 ( all were supposedly recalled in 1960 ) actually had one of these torpedoes on his ship, do you think he really would have tried to use a device that hasent ever worked correctly? I know we were depth charging the sub at the time but still..
The problem was size. The standard nukes they were just starting to produce in the late 1950’s were more than a 1000mm in diameter. A standard torpedo tube was 530mm. the payload diameter was a mere 470mm. They just couldnt make a decent nuke that small. Either could we. The one that they could fit had little power, was untested and prone to failure and weighed too much so the torpedo itself sank.
I find this very interesting. Can you supply a link to that information; I would appreciate it.
Ed
This is what I found and everything I have read contradicts your statement. It appears that these weapons were deployed in late 1960 onward.
In a civil case the decision is to be based upon a preponderance of testimony. The historical records are pretty significant.
http://survincity.com/2012/02/russian-nuclear-torpedoes-t-15-and-t-5/
at the end of 1960 began to come into service 533-millimeter ASBZO (self-contained special warhead section) for production models of torpedoes. ASBZO development capacity of 20 kilotons started according to Council of Ministers of the USSR on February 13, 1957 at KB-25 Minsredmasha USSR and SRI-400 Minsudproma USSR. Specifically enacting ASBZO was the end for special nuclear torpedoes.
And another
h ttp://patch.com/connecticut/avon/bp–soviet-subs-sail-for-cuba-armed-with-nuclear-torpedoes
When and if you see Obama and the highest ranking elites suddenly going off the radar with their whereabouts unaccounted for in the press you know he’s getting ready to pull the trigger.
At that point it would be a good idea to “Duck and cover” or something.
As Patton said. One day there will be war with these sons-of-bitches, so let me start it now and I’ll make it look like they started.
As the Cornel said in Red Dawn, (first movie). “Two toughest kids on the block one day they will tangle”.
If we would have let Patton go, we today wouldn’t have to worry about what the Movie Red Dawn was like.
Sgt.
If we let Patton go what would you and I received as a benefit? At least double the casualties we had fighting Germany and that is a very conservative figure. A destroyed world. Maybe US business in the absence of a counter force fleeing a few decades earlier than they did post USSR breakup.
Putin threatening you? Assad threatening you? Ask the same questions about Saudis.
How did Syria go from fighting terrorism 9who by the way we created) to removing Assad? An oil pipeline is how.
Leave it to sgt. dale for the most stupid comment of the night award. Well done sarge, keep watching those old WW2 movies and applying them to today, really makes you sound intelligent.
K2
We could have A-B0mbed Russia. That would have made a difference. World opinion and all that stuff stopped it.
Russia did not have the bomb till later.
WHY are we fighting Russia, anyway????
I understand if you maintain they are still crypto-communist, but I don’t buy that. Assuming they are not communists, bent on turning the world into an Orwellian state (besides the left in the West is already doing a great job of that), what’s the point? Are we just the new Britain of the late 1800s, fighting geopolitical wars for resources, territory, and so we can make the map with more pink on it, just like Britannia like in the old days?
Sorry, I don’t hate Russians, or anyone else. I do hate the vile evil of communism, and the evil that the left does to other human beings. I can’t stand the feminazis, and am disgusted with Islam, which is simply a religion of evil. We may well have to fight Islam, a la Charles Martel or Jan Sobieski, but that is with the polity that is Islam.
Meanwhile, who cares? Is Russia positioning tanks in Toronto? (No telling WHAT Boy Wonder Trudeau will do next, of course!) Let’s butt out of this one.
Slingshot
And Gain What?
You desire to Marshall Plan Eastern Europe too? The USSR kept US manufacturing in America. The fear of communist nationalization precluded any idea of exporting manufacturing to the 3rd world. The Free Trade agreements came down post USSR collapse. The USSR generally kept the Islamic Crazies under wraps in their zone of influence as they didn’t want anyone picking a fight for them.
Its reality.
Slingshot,
You’re right, the US had a 4 year window of nuclear monopoly and we could have bombed anybody we liked without fear. But, that would have made us the equivalent of the guys we had just fought for 4 years to defeat. Just because you have the ability to annihilate somebody doesn’t mean you do it. That would have led to irradiating a large part of Asia for who knows how long, with fallout traveling to other parts of the globe not involved with the fighting. The US would have become outcasts in the rest of the world and nobody, not even our former allies would have accepted the need for the US to ever do that and nobody in the world would have ever trusted the US again. Now, you may say that it wouldn’t matter whether they trusted us or not, but what would have happened is worldwide fear of the US. And when you get the entire world afraid of you, you just made the entire world your enemy instead of friend. Enemies who would have plotted, planned, and fought against us at every opportunity, just like partisan groups fought against the Germans and Japanese in WW2. Yeah, if we had done that then Russia or China never get the atomic bomb but what would become of the US? Would we be still be here, yeah, probably so, but having the entire rest of the globe against you at every turn would force us to take over the whole planet or nuke everybody who opposed us. Not the best or brightest road to travel, at least in my opinion.
Um I think it was slick willie that got rid of the SR 71.
Sunglasses, case of beer and a beach view… Fuck It
And a locked and loaded AR in case any of them get away!
Where is Cyndi Sheehan and the anti-war people when we need them????
Oh, right. They are all in their “Yes we can/Yes we have no bananas” chant-ins, or dressing up to act as Hilary’s flying monkeys a la Wizard of Oz
Depending on what type of exchange, warning time and how many nuclear devices I catch in my area. I say I have about a 35% chance of living through it. Only the attack that is. The aftermath is another story but still better than those who have not prepared at all.
Have any of you really thought about it?
If one is coming I’m getting so close to ground zero that if its a ground burst I want to be crushed by the warhead prior to detonation.
sling, who here HASN”T thought about it?
I could survive in our concrete basement with wife and dogs for awhile, until we all went crazy or somethin’.
Being able to go outside for a few minutes a day would suck. Then your hair starts falling out, all the trees and vegetation dies, oops, time to get back inside.
Now, a limited nuclear exchange, whereby some leaders acknowledge their insanity and stop launching, maybe many of us could survive. For a while longer. Maybe for the rest of our lifespan.
Either way, all bets are off.
I hope all the government spies on the web get taken out.
And, I’ll take COF’s approach:
Sunglasses, case of rum, and beach view.
KUOD
Living through a nuclear attack is complicated. That is if you want to live. The initial blast and fires turn into fallout. An air burst is the worst for destruction as the blast is radiated downward but the spread of fallout is less. A ground burst would send more particles into the air. We are splitting hairs here. There are many books on the subject.
You might be lucky to be at a place that is not attacked
Then what do you do? That information can make all the difference. Keep in mind. Sooner or later the whole world will be affected. Like Fukishima, Japan.
Slingshot
I grew up thinking about it. Born in 54, and lived through all these crazy years knowing it could happen. Building an earth bermed house that was originally mostly underground and gave it up for rainwater collection. No water is a fast way to die. Imagine thinking about nuclear war when designing your dream cabin. Surely we have all thought about it.Everyone on this site, anyway. Some can’t bear the thought.
Rebecca.
I am going to give a shot at living. There is too much info to be put here in type. One can die most likely from thirst, starvation or radiation sickness in this case.
Slingshot
I will try for living too. But even for all that I live 30 miles with mountain between from a military target, and most of my adult life has been the same. In 1970 my mom worked as a lowly mail clerk on Elmendorf in Anchorage and talked about radiation fallout maps she saw way back then. Wind patterns etc. I think that surviving the initial blast is mostly about deep cover for a few weeks. Something like Fukushima isn’t a single blast but is an ongoing puke of cesium right into the Japanese Current, bringing that mess straight down our west coast every day of the week. Funny how MSM refused to acknowledge the Japanese Current and blathered about dispersion into the huge Pacific Ocean.
So yes, the Southern Hemisphere is likely to be the future if nuclear war happens. Chernobyl is still spewing.
Rebecca
Wind patterns, rain and distance. I have read that it is about two weeks in cover before going outside. That would drive many crazy. How does one train for that?
The majority of us feel safe. The world is afire. War, Riots and so much violence and we dismiss the daily news “crime de jour” as if it was nothing.
To OUR Disadvantage. People who visit here scare the living hell out of other people. I know I do. Some of my friends ask me questions because they do not want to be left out of the loop. They keep my information in the back of their minds. I have shown them objects of home defense that catches their interest. They don’t have to get them but now they know what is available to them.
A plus if they choose to change their minds and start prepping. Even if I just get them to put a First Aid kit in the car or truck. I made a difference.
Slingshot
Introvert here, I can do 2 weeks in a small space. I love outdoors though.
I also feel good if I can get people to do one good move toward self protection and self-sufficiency. Once they do one thing, they will do another… I know I have eased a lot of people into easy gardening over the years.
I have looked at some nuclear wind drift maps, and always know what direction my wind and rain come from. Odd here, part of the year from the west and Pacific, part of the year from the southeast and Gulf of Mexico. A nuclear attack during the west wind would go harder on me, even though that 10000 ft mountain would take part of it.
Have you wondered whether a nuclear attack on the west coast would set off volcano eruptions? My kid lives right under Mount Rainier.
Well it will be the USA that looses. China whom they are also agitating will join with Russia and the USA will be finished.
As Albert Einstein said; “If WWIII is fought with nuclear weapons, WWIV will be fought with sticks and stones”
No one wins, all losers. Actually a dynamic shift would likely occur in the thereafter development of the human race. The targeted areas, primarily the developed world would take a backseat to the non targeted or minimally targeted developing or undeveloped world. South America, tropical Africa, undeveloped unknown Asia would likely dramatically increase in dominance.
Kevin2
I hadn’t thought much on that. Southern hemisphere would be as clean as it would get… still damaged but not ruined. Some of my friends are talking moving to other countries, but the globalists cause trouble everywhere. This is home. I don’t plan to go but I will mention it to those who might.
The less value it has the less likely to be targeted.
I asked my friends father who retired early with a bad heart as an Air Force Major in the late 1970s who was a bombardier / navigator on a B-52 with SAC in his service time where they were to land in the event that they actually, “dropped the ball” and they dropped the nuclear bombs. I said, “Obviously your not going back to where you came from because guaranteed there would be nothing there”. He did that military thing those guys do and just ignored my question. I think the only thing that makes sense is to go somewhere untouched. I would like to know where that is.
Kevin2
This whole conversation is about what happens when psychopaths and their defenders get in charge. People need to quit defending the psychopaths and quit voting for them. 1% of human beings are born psychopath and they tell us they are superior.
The traits that sociopaths have, no empathy, no remorse, narcissistic, greedy and amoral tends to serve them well climbing in any organization. I think when you have an honest forthright leader its an anomaly.
Kevin2
But I have worked for non sociopath folks and refused to work for the bad ones. It takes a LOT of support for these people to get where they can damage so much.